Finally! 3.7 V6 for Mustang in 2011

Ford's getting rid of the boat anchor 4.0 V-6 in favor of the 3.7 finally! And going toe to toe with Chevy Camaro's 300 hp/29 mpg with 307 hp/30 mpg. Read all about it at Autoblog.
Now, let's see when we can expect that IRS?

Again no camera, but I did talk to New York Mustangs club today

On May 31st I was driving home from my office on a nice weekend morning when I heard then saw a line of almost 100 Mustangs. I kicked myself because I didn't have a camera . There I was stuck at a red light watching this parade of personalized late model pony cars. Well, today I stopped for coffee and there were 5 hot Mustangs, including 3 SVT Cobras, with IRS, and their owners. I walked up to the group of guys and started talking. I mentioned how I kicked myself for not having a camera and they told me all about their club New York Mustangs and their website (link in title title) and forums. As you would expect of a group of Mustang fanatics, a real nice group, with some very special ponies. Again, no camera, but I hope to meet up with this group again.

So, of course I couldn't restrain myself from asking for their opinion on an issue that I've talked about a lot over the last few years, the Mustangs lack of an IRS . And I was especially interested in hearing from the SVT Cobra owners, their opinion on the strenght of the IRS in their cars. The SVT Cobra was powerful enough out of the box, but these guys have warmed theirs over considerably, one guy putting 650 hp through the IRS. He was the only one to have any problems, but with 650 hp, that's to be expected. The other SVT Cobras are far from stock, but neither has ever had an issue. The other Mustang owners said they love their cars, but wonder how in 2010 a Mustang can't have an IRS, while they pointed out that the Camaro and Chalenger both have one. Preaching to the choir guys, I'm with you.

Take a look at my archives, go over to Jeff's site, Driving Enthusiast dot Net and read past posts, then e-mail Ford and ask them when the Mustan will get what it needs to be complete. I nearly said competative, but that would be misleading, since it's true that the Mustang is more than competing, even if initail Camaro sales are beating Mustang, in the long game it will all be Ford's to loose.

EcoBoost to spread across FoMoCo lines in coming years, maybe even Mustang

When I went to the recent Lincoln event and drove the MKT and MKZ there was much EcoBoost talk. I even got to talk with Dan, one of the project heads and ask him about the migration of this technology across the FoMoCo line. Currently available in the Lincoln MKS and MKT flagships and the Ford Flex and Taurus SHO, the EcoBoost in 3.5 V6 355 hp glory will next be seen in the F-150 range as well. But there's a lot more to this story than that. While it's true that you can achieve V6 economy and V8 power in the larger vehicles, it's also going to be applied to I-4 engines to give superior economy with V6 power. We're going to see EcoBoost 2.0L engines with 200+ hp and even smaller engines with EcoBoost.

Not knowing if I'd ever get a chance like this again, I popped the question. No I didn't ask Dan for his hand in marriage, I asked him if we could expect to see EcoBoost in the Mustang. At first he assumed I meant the 355 hp V6 in the Mustang GT and told me that it was unlikely since Ford had new V8s which will offer superior performance and better economy. I acknowledged that and corrected myself by asking if we could possibly see an EcoBoost I4 in the "Base" Mustang? And being the smart guy he is, I'm unable to say "Yes" but there's enough wiggle room in what he said to guess that it's a distinct possability. And before the old guard Mustang guys start spitting nails let's see what's possible.

I doubt they would revive the SVT or SVO label for a Turbo 4 Mustang, not with the Shelby GTs.

It wouldn't be some pricey option, but a replacement for the V6 that makes 210 hp and achieves poor fuel economy. In Reality an EcoBoost 4 could produce more power and boost FoMoCo's CAFE ratings. And you're wondering where Ford would get such an engine?

Did you forget the Ford Explorer America Concept that was shown last year?

That has 275hp EcoBoost 2.0L 4 cylinder power.

So, while Dan didn't say it was going to happen, he didn't say no either.

Ford is going to spread EcoBoost across the model lineup, maybe just maybe in the next generation Mustang we'll see better power and fuel economy and an IRS?

Dan didn't mention anything about the IRS, that's just a matter for common sense.

FoMoCo Mustang news that I just can't get excited about....

So, I've been seeing tons of tweets and blog posts on some new Mustang "news" that I just can't get excited about. The return of the glass roof option for 2009. Had they stopped this? Will it continue for 2010? While it's something that sounds cool and looks good, it's always been something I have an issue with. Mustangs have not had moonroofs from the factory for at least the last 19 years, maybe more. I remember I wanted one on my 91 Mustang and the dealer told me that Ford didn't offer it. He suggested I get a convertible. Ok, flash forward to 1994 and the "new" Mustang, still no sun/moonroof, but there was the convertible option. Ok, so now jump ahead a decade and the 2004 release of the 2005 "All New" Mustang! Nope, no sun/moonroof.
I seem to be alone in missing the moonroof, an option I've had inseveral cars. But a couple of years ago Ford decided to offer the glass panoramic roof, nice! But, it doesn't open. And it has a sunshade so your chrome dome doesn't get third degree burns. But it doesn't open! So, it's back.
Even the Hyundai Genesis Coupe has a moonroof. I'm going to have to check GM and Chrysler to see if the Chalenger and Camaro have moonroof options. Glass roof, big deal.

And in further farce news, there's a 45th Aniversary Lee Iacocca special edition Mustang.
Not from FoMoCo, but from Galpin Ford in So Cal? Special body kit, only 45 to be made, blah blah blah..... Who cares? I'm sure they'll sell every one of them, but who really cares, other than the few collectors.

You know what, if you want to send me good news about the Mustang, tell me they're finally going to put a 21st century suspension under the rear.

If you want the latest news on these two "special" Mustangs, visit AutoBlog, Jalopnik or one of the media sites listed in sidebar. I'm waiting for some REAL Mustang news.

The real reason the 05 and forward Mustang doesn't have an IRS, let's do away with the lies and excuses

Since the earliest days of MyFordDreams one of my biggest criticisms of Ford has been the lack of an Independent Rear Suspension when they redesisgned for model year 2005. After all the Mustang was designed down from the latest rear wheel drive chassis Ford had at the time, and that was the Lincoln LS and Ford Thunderbird chassis and both of those cars had IRS. But it's misleading to say that the Mustang was based on these two cars, it was engineered down from them, sharing mostly the front part of the chassis. Excuses at the time, that continue to this day are that in order to keep the Mustang at a profitable pricepoint it was decided to leave out the IRS. And when the Mustang was the only real Pony car available in 2005 you could almost buy that. But let's clear some of the bullshit away ok?

Many have argued that the complexity and weight of the IRS were too much for the Mustang's "low" price of entry. But if that's true, how can Chrysler afford to have an IRS on the 300/Magnum/Charger/Challenger chassis? Well, they did inherit that from Mercedes previous generation E-Class, so the development costs were less. How about the new Camaro? That has a new chassis, with IRS and the price jump over the Mustang isn't extreme. And let's not forget Hyundai's new Genesis Coupe, that matches Mustang's pricepoint and power, but does so with an IRS.

As I mentioned in my last post, some have argued that the Mustang had an IRS offered in 1999 and 2000 SVT Cobra models, but owners took them out to save weight and increase strenght for drag racing. While that may fool some folks, that's part of the bullshit I want to clear the air on.

Firstly, the Cobra was a limited production model and yes owners of the SVT Cobra may want to take those beasts drag racing. But Corvettes race, Chargers and Magnums, maybe even 300Cs? You can bet your ass that Camaro owners will bring their new cars to the track. And all of those have IRS. And if you're modifying a car for strictly track duty, you're more than likely back halfing the chassis or doing a full tube chassis anyway. No my friends, that's just bullshit.

Ford Motor Company wasn't responding to pressure from devoted Pony Car customers who wanted to go racing.

They were responding to the customers who made the 2005 Mustang the hit it was.

Don't fool yourself or try and lie to me. It was rental fleets that bought the vast majority of 2005 and 2006 Mustangs. And it was for that reason the Mustang didn't get an IRS. The rental companies wanted to keep it simple, because they knew they'd have to service and repair the cars. As P.J. O'Rourke said in Driving Like Crazy, the best car for driving fast is a Rental car.

And one of the ways to keep those rental cars profitable, is to keep them simple, keep them mediocre. Keep a live axle under the Mustang for the Rental fleets, not he enthusiasts.

In 2006 and 2007 there were a flood of "Program" Mustangs on Ford dealer lots, because they'd all done their first year in Rental fleets. And let's face it, that boosted Mustang sales in a big way. If I recall Ford sold 190,000 Mustangs in 2005, more than they anticipated. And how many of them do you want to guess went to Florida, Las Vegas, Southern California rental fleets?

But now Ford has pledged as part of the Way Forward to cut the umbilical cord of Fleet Sales, because they know that it's not good for their image. Who wants to buy a Rental car?
Of course you have to keep the live axle if you're selling to rental fleets at discounted prices and then force feeding your dealer network those rental rejects a year later.

But let's assume Ford wants to truly be competative with the Mustang. They'll need that IRS and we'll end up paying a couple of thousand dollars more for the car as a result. But they'll make more profit per unit and improve their global image. Who hasn't seen Top Gear's reviews of the Mustangs over the last few years and heard Hammond, May and Clarkson refer to the Mustangs chassis as being like a Conastoga Wagon?

An IRS will add weight to the car, complexity and cost, but it will also make the car more sure footed and safer on choppy roads. Take this from a former Mustang owner, who's had his Mustang up to 130 mph on public highways in dry weather, but gotten passed by Honda Civics in bad weather and on twisty parkways with rough pavement.

No more lies, no more excuses, no more bullshit. Let's tell it how it is. And let's get an IRS under that Pony soon

Update, Motor Trend has similar piece, that has more information;

Angus MacKenzie at Motortrend.com 2010 Ford Mustang near enough is not good enough

I know Jeff at http://www.drivingenthusiasts.net/ has a clearer point of view on this and if I'm not mistaken has written on it in the past. He may also be able to clear up some of my mistakes.

Jeff's blog post! I can always count on Jeff at drivingenthusiasts.net to clear up any mistakes I make on this subject. Jeff's knowledge is encyclopedic.

Same old excuses and arguments about IRS for Mustang

I recently joined FoMoCoNews.com's forums and it never fails, you hear the same old excuses and arguments against an IRS for the Mustang.
"It was available once and it was not a "draw" for additional customers. In fact, several customers swapped in a live rear axle because it was lighter and better for drag racing !"
And my response? "I've heard that before, but let's not forget that not all Mustang buyers will be going down the quarter mile. And don't Chalengers, Camaros, Corvettes, BMWs and even Cadillac CTSVs go drag racing? "

The promise of a 2013 IRS Mustang is nice, as is the increase in power, but even Hyundai's Genesis Coupe has IRS and the 2.0 Turbo 4 has 210 hp to the Mustang 4.0's 210. You can love Mustangs and still point out their lacking. That's how you improve the breed. You can't design a car for the 21st Century just to go fast in a straight line. Even though I've read great reviews of the new multi-link live axel's handling, it's laughable to excuse the lack of IRS at this late date.

And I say yet again, why no IRS for the Mustang?! I'll keep saying it until I'm blue in the face or there's an IRS under the Mustang. You don't design a car for the 21st Century using a live axel.

No argument or excuse is valid, period.

Mustang to get 3.7 V-6 in 2011? Finally a six worthy of a Mustang

So I read over at AutoBlog (linked in title) that FoMoCo is about to get rid of the boat anchor 4.0 SOHC V-6 and replace it with the Duratec 3.7 DOHC V-6. Great news! It seems such a shame to have this great wrapper for such a dog engine, finally there can be a V-6 Mustang worthy of it's name. The 3.7 beats the 4.0's 210 hp by about 50hp and I'm sure the sound will be more fitting than the current truck motor. Igor, a frequent commentor here has been saying this for quite a while and I've been begging for it for just as long. AutoBlog speculates that they could get as much as 300 hp from a naturally aspirated 3.7, matching Chevy's Camaro. And let's not forget the 365 hp in EcoBoost trim. So, Ford is finally pulling up to the bar, 400 hp V-8 and hopefully 300 hp V-6, it's about time. But there's one more little thing.....

When will the Mustang finally have an IRS? Ford makes/made units that can take the power. Just look at the above photo of the Australian Falcon's IRS or below at the 1999/2000 Mustang SVT Cobra's IRS units. I have read every excuse over the years, "There isn't a unit that can handle the power" Bull#*# ! "You can't make it profitable" Well, how come GM, Chrysler, Hyundai and Nissan can? "You can't retrofit one onto the current chassis" But what about the below Cobra unit? That apparently can be bolted onto any 1979-2004 Mustang.

Enough excuses, you're fixing the power defecit, fix the chassis too.

Pony Car battle on YouTube from Motor Trend. I guess I'm going to stop carping about the IRS

A friend of mine told me about this so I looked it up on YouTube. Based on this video maybe I'll stop carping about the lack of Independant Rear Suspension.

The Mustangs you see when you don't have a camera! Damn!

So, today is a beautiful near summer day and I was out running errands this morning, when I come to a red light. I hear before I see a row of SVT Mustang Cobras and other modified pony cars and as is Murphy's Law, that's when I realise I've left my camera at home. Doh!
It was 9:30 am and the road was empty as 20-25 very nice examples of Dearborn's greatest rolled by me. The sound of Superchargers and tuned exhaust filling the semi-industrial area with music to my ears.

I had even bought a small digital camera like this one just for this type of thing.

But dumb me I brought it in the house to download some photos from a party and left it on my desk.

The Car Connection's comparison of Mustang & Camaro needs to take the gloves off

So, I was reading Rex Roy's piece comparing the 2010 Mustang & Camaro. Overal a well written piece, but you know me I have to comment, it's in my nature. First I want to criticise early in the piece when he talks of V6 Mustangs and Camaros being called "Secretary's Cars". First, the Mustang when it was first introduced may have been called that in 64. I personally believe the only one who used that term was Carroll Shelby in an effort to hype his Shelby Mustangs when they came out. But also I'd like to point out that neither the Mustang or Camaro used a "V-6" until 1974 for the Mustang and 1982 for Camaro. Both were initially available with I-6 engines. It's the little details that real car guys notice. And while I agree that the Mustang's styling has had a nice refreshing, I believe Rex needs to take off the gloves on this one. I love Mustangs, but when you love something you have to be extra critical.

And the new 2010 Camaro, especially the LS V-6 model, kicks the pony's ass up and down the block. More base power, 300hp vs 210hp and better fuel economy 29mpg hwy vs 26mpg hwy, are major advantages for Chevy. And let's not forget the IRS! I haven't driven the 2010 Mustang, but I have driven the 05 & 06 models. I also haven't driven the Camaro, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that the fully independant suspension of the Camaro will mean a much more livable and stable ride on rough roads and better handling in the twisties.

So, you're saying "Joe, give the Mustang a chance" and I'm saying that Ford needs to give the Mustang some major improvements. Tough love is love just the same

Thinking about the CAFE standards and the Mustang..

You know, most of the news about the Mustang has been good lately. New powertrains promissed and great styling. But with the anouncement of new Corporate Average Fuel Economy standards it got me thinking. What would be a really great idea?

How about this, a 2.0 EcoBoost powered Mustang! How about that 275 hp Explorer America concept's twin turbo 2.0? Now, here me out here folks. I know the 5.0 will be dishing out 400 hp and that's a great thing for the GT. But how about the turbo 4 for the Pony Mustang? Isn't the rumored Ranger replacement coming with a 1.8 l EcoBoost ? And that will ahve 175 hp 180 lb ft of torque. So, sine they'll be doing the work to fit an EcoBoost in a rear wheel drive vehicle already, how hard could it be to do it in a Mustang? You could have 3 levels of Mustang, the Base with the EcoBoost I-4, a mid level with the EocBoost V-6 and the GT with the Coyote V-8.

Just a middle of the night thought. Well maybe a dream really, but isn't that what I do.

Finally getting in the game, Ford to offer 400 hp 5.0 V-8 ! Looks like Igor was right

Autoblog is reporting that Ford is finally getting back into the horsepower game.
Looks like frequent commentor Igor was right. Not that there hadn't been plenty of rumors and stories about the return of the 5.0 for a while now, but it looks like a new 32 valve DOHC V-8 with 400 hp and 400 lb ft of torque will be coming in 2010. And mention of an EcoBoost V-6 as well.

It's about blooddy time! The current 315-320 hp GT and 210 hp base are no slouches, but wtih everybody and their mother offering more power, it's just not good enough to be the bargain muscle car anymore. When the Mustang was the only Pony Car on the market, Ford could breathe easy. But competition is strong now, with the rebirth of the Challenger and Camaro, both outgunning the current Mustang. And don't forget the Hyundai Genesis Coupe, with it's base 2.0 Turbo I-4 beating base Mustang's 210 hp, and the V-6 putting out 360 hp.

This is great news, now when can we expect that IRS? When will the Mustang be truly comparable to the pack?

Do I have any favorable words about the Mustang?

I've been beating up on my beloved Mustang quite a bit lately. I've complained about the lack of an IRS and the low horsepower compared to new competitors. So, can I say anything nice about the Mustang? Sure, without being hypocritical, it's still a great bargain performance car.

Even, maybe especially, if you consider the V6 Mustang. There are all sorts of aftermarket parts and kits that transform your "rental" Stang into a real fun and fairly fast car. And even though the GT "only" comes with 320 hp, we all know that with the right choices an owner can pump that well over 400 hp. I would suggest that you avoid the flash and go right for the performance upgrades. How many supercharger or turbocharger kits are there? Too many to count.

In all honesty, if I were to buy a new Mustang, I'd go for the Pony Package and then install an STS Turbo kit or Eaton Supercharger.

If what Igor said in comments recently are true, then things will get a lot better in 2012.

Until then, 05 forward Mustangs will continue to be the bargain performer. Maybe one of these days, when the economy improves I'll buy a used 05-06 Pony and add that STS?

It always comes back to the lack of IRS for me

I've been seeing a lot of photos and now reviews of the new 2010 Mustang and of course the SVT Shelby GT500 lately and while everything is written in glowing terms, it always comes back to the lack of an IRS for me.



I don't care how great the new Mustang is, and I'm sure it is, at this time, there is no excuse for the lack of an independant rear suspension, none at all. For years I've read that it would be too expensive or that an IRS couldn't handle the power. Tell that to Chrysler, Chevrolet, BMW, Mercedes and Hyundai! Enough is enough!



The Mustang has been the lone Pony Car for a number of years now, since Chevrolet stopped making the Camaro, but the Camaro is back and so is the Chalenger. And both of them have independant rear suspensions. Sure, they're more expensive than the Mustang, but how about the Hyundai Genesis Coupe? That starts at the same base price the Mustang and that has IRS.

How about the power? Well, Ford sells the Australian Ford Falcon with an IRS and as much horsepower as the Mustang if not more in the FPV versions. Camaro, Challenger and even the Hyundai, all have more power available than the Mustang GT's 320 and they have IRS.

The excuses have worn thin. So, while I love the Mustang, I see huge chances for improvement.
Don't even get me started on the 4.0 SOHC V6!

Jalopnik has updated FoMoCo Aussie Falcon/Mustang rumors...

Jalopnik has a piece ( linked in title ) about the latest resurgance of rumors that Ford will use the Australian Ford Falcon as the base for the next Mustang and other rear wheel drive vehicles like the Interceptor. Nothing really earth shattering here, rumors like this have been floating around the net for quite a while. Jalopnik refers to an article in the Detroit News by Bryce Hoffman.
With the emergence of real competition from Hyundai, Chrysler and GM, all with IRS as oposed to the Mustangs live axle, this is something that has been common sense to everyone. Hell I've written about this so often I'm not even going to bother linking to past posts, it would take too long.

The Aussie Falcon just got a redo, but has had the Control Blade IRS for several years. The currency situation makes it expensive to import the cars to the United States, more so that when I suggested it several years ago. But the Detroit News article says they're moving "development" to the US, not importing actual units. The chassis would be developed here in the US, used for the future Australian Falcon, new Mustang and Ford and Lincoln branded sedans. No mention of Mercury there? As Jalopnik points out that's a glaring omission.

A new Mustang and a new Rear Wheel Drive sedan for Lincoln and Ford is good news.

But the artilce says it will be 4 years until they reach market, will that be soon enough?
And what about CAFE requirements? I've said before that the 2.0 EcoBoost I4 should go in the Mustang as the base motor, but how about the Sedans? Well, FoMoCo has the direct injection V6 for them. I'm not sure a V8 is even needed, except for top of the line showcase models.

What about Mercury? Well, I've said before that Mercury should be reimagined as an outlet for Ford Import models like the Mondeo. The Fusion does well for Ford, but as nice as the Milan is and it's sharp, maybe a premium could be charged for the imported Mondeo? I know that the next Mondeo and Fusion should, according to what I've read online, be based on the same platform, but until then, give Mercury dealers something unique.

How about the Ford Kuga as the next Mercury Mariner? Until these platforms are under a US Ford product, use Mercury to bring them here and that can justify the premium prices.

Just my 2 cents.

Why buy a Mustang? When will FoMoCo see the light?

Back in 04 when I went to Nashville for the 40th Aniversary of the Mustang and saw the 05 up close and personal I was amazed. The rebirth of a great car! And I bought FoMoCo's line of crap that an IRS would push the price up and keep the Mustang from being competative. It didn't bother me that the base Mustang engine would be the 4.0 V6 from the ranger with 210 hp or that the GT's 4.6 V8 was only putting out 300 hp. But that was 04 and now in 08 Ford had better wake up and smell the coffee!

Ford has an IRS that can handle the power, look no further than their Australian Falcon range.

The Control Blade IRS has been available down under since before he current New Mustang came to market. And now with real competition coming from Detroit and Korea, all with IRS by the way, what does FoMoCo offer us? Not much from where I'm sitting.

Take a look at David that will slay Mustang. The Hyundai Genesis Coupe coming next year.

The V6 model will have over 300 hp meeting the Mustang GT on power and pricepoint, but with the IRS the Mustang so sorely lacks. And what really kills me is the base engine for the Hyundai will be a Turbo Direct Injection I4 putting out 212 hp! Oh and by the way it will also have the IRS. I've been saying for a whle, that FoMoCo needs to put an IRS under the Mustang and when I first saw the power of the MazdaSpeed3's 2.3 Turbo Direct Injected I4 I said SVO Mustang! I'd read online that FoMoCo will use the upcoming 2.0 EcoBoost I4 as the base engine for a future Explorer, great news since it will be putting out well over 200 hp, but why can't that be the Mustang's base engine?

Even GM sees the light! Check the article here at AutoBlog to see how Bob Lutz is suggesting that they could put a 2.0 Turbo Direct Injection engine in a version of the Camaro. And why not, if it's the new Cobalt SS turbo putting out 260 hp!

And what does FoMoCo have in store for us? A new Bullit Mustang and a mild refresh in 09?

I have some advice for them, get the Control Blade, put it under the Mustang, take the 2.0 EcoBoost I4 make it the base engine for the Mustang, take the Turbo Direct Injected 3.5 stuff that in the Mustang and if you insist on a V8 make sure that has 400 hp!

It's frustrating being a Ford fan, it really is. I wonder if Dearborn has any clue what they're doing.

I was looking for pictures of my Mustang and found these..

I loved my Mustang, a 1991 LX 5.0 notchback with manual trans and 3.08 rear. Totally stock, but lots of fun to take to Englishtown Raceway Park. My buddy Joe Z and I used to go down a couple of times each year.

Here's a blast from the past! I totally forgot I had this video...

My good friend also named Joe and I used to take our Mustangs to Englishtown Raceway Park several times a season just to have fun. My Mustang was bone stock, 5.0 LX Notchback with a 5 spd manual and 3.08 rear gears. And I had thought I lost this video long ago. It's poor quality, but it's

There better be something really impressive under the the mask on that 09 Mustang or else ........

There had better be something really impressive about the refresh for the 09 Mustang or Ford can be expected to be handed their ass on a platter. It's bad enough that domestic competition is on it's way with the Camaro and Challenger, or that Japanese coupes will erode market share for Mustang, but now Hyundai?!

I was reading AutoBlog and found the story linked in title with pics of the what may be the new RWD coupe coming next year. And you know what? It looks good and if the specs are correct it's better than a Mustang on paper. And probably on the track too. While a V6 Mustang starts at $19k (realy $21K) and has 210 hp, the new Hyundai coupe will start at similar price and have a 2.0 Turbo I-4, making 215 hp! And do you think Hyundai is going to have a solid rear axel? Not a chance, I saw the Genesis concept at the NY show in April, IRS was visible and that's what I've read since. And before you say the Mustang GT has 300 HP in a V8, take a look at the specs for the V6 coupe, 300 hp and the price? Matching the base price of the Mustang GT. And what if Hyundai drops their V8 in the coupe? Well I've read that their V8 is expected to put out 360 hp without a supercharger. And you know one other thing that pisses me off? The Hyundai Coupe concept here has a moonroof, something you can't get on a Mustang. And don't tell me the Mustang comes as a convertible, if I were looking for a coupe, I'd want a moonroof. And you never know, Hyundai could eventually come out with a convertible if they feel the market will bear it. Jesus H Christ! Ford should shit themselves if Hyundai ever tries their hand at a full size truck! No doubt they won't screw it up like Toyota and Nissan did.

And I laughed my ass off the first time I drove a Hyundai back in 87. I was shopping for my first new car and bought a Ford Festiva, because it was better quality and had more equipment. Sure I payed over $1800 more than the Excell's base price, but I knew I was getting a better car. Coincidentally from Korea and actually built by Kia, who Hyundai now owns!

I like the idea of the 2.0 Turbo I4 and RWD, I had suggested Ford do something similar with this generation Mustang, replace the 4.0 V6 with a 2.3 or maybe 2.5. Comments were negative, but I saw it as a new SVO. Hell, when this comes out I'll take one for a spin and based on the quality I've seen from Hyundai over the last couple of years, who knows, maybe I'll buy one.

Unbelievable, Ford out Mustanged by Hyundai???